More mature Star Fox?

[Xortberg]

I still say yes to a more mature Star Fox because of this: Darker and more mature fanfics that have been showing up on the net.

>Mfw basing where you think a video game series should go on fanfiction

With a darker and edgier modification to their source material, said fanworks won't be as much of a ba@#$%dization of the games than they are right now.

Oh, yeah! Lets make the story of a game series totally shitty so the shitty fanfics people have made will look less shitty in comparison! IT'S BRILLIANT! News flash, fanfiction takes a backseat over the actual canon. I love season 1 of Digimon. It was quite lighthearted. I write the occasional fanfic for it with a more mature theme. That does not mean the original season would warrant a gritty fucking reboot.

If you want Star Fox to be a kiddy game, guess what? Nintendo's already overcrowded with kiddy games; Mario, Yoshi, Donkey Kong, Kirby, Starfy, Pikmin, almost everything on the NES, and don't get me started on the Miis. If Star Fox stays down that road it'll end up lost in an overworked machine that's desperately in need of a break.

First off, nobody wants SF to be a kiddy game. Second, none of those franchises you mentioned are kiddy games. They're games aimed at a wide variety of audiences. Kiddy games are Barbie and Bratz and Dora the Explorer-based video games. Kiddy games are aimed primarily at - you guessed it - KIDS! These series you mentioned, including SF, have always been aimed from kids to adults, meaning they want everyone to be able to enjoy it.

Star Fox needs to take the same direction in story as Assault, but go a bit grimmer. Maybe only a little bit of blood and mild profanity. No nudity, but maybe some more intimate scenes that further reveal something buried deep in both Fox and Krystal.

Have you not payed any attention at all in this entire topic? Darker and grimmer does not a better game make. I guarantee you, right now, you can name pretty much any fandom represented on FF.net. This is a dare, by the way, if you're willing to take it. Name one fandom on FF.net with a reasonable number of entries and I will find an example of a horribly written grimdark fic and a wonderful example of a more lighthearted fic. Granted, it can easily work in the opposite direction, but the point is making it dark and edgy will not make it good. It only makes it dark and edgy.

See, the problem with SF isn't that it isn't dark enough, bro. Dark doesn't fix everything. As you said before, look at what it did to the Sonic series. The problem lies in either the gameplay or the skill of the writing team. Or both. If the current writing team makes the switch to dark and gritty, it'll still be the same shitty writing that you're complaining about and saying is 'too kiddy.' The only thing that would change is that they would write shittily to different subject matter. If the series wants to be fixed, gameplay should be the first focus. After all, this is a game. If you want a good story, a book is the medium of choice. Games are meant to be interactive first, as you said in the 'Box Art' topic, and literary second.

[ARWINGCOMMANDER 3987]

FINALLY somebody actually listens to me.

Anyway, why would a grimdark storyline be a bad change for the series? You know what goes on in the series? War. What happens in war? Dark stuff? What kind of dark stuff? People die and cities are blown to the ground. How is it even possible for a game about a war, unless you don't kill anybody onscreen, to be a game for the whole family? Without any emphasis on the wars in the Lylat System, how can they keep Star Fox from turning into the 1980s G.I. Joe?

[ARWINGCOMMANDER 3987]

You know what goes on in the series? War. What happens in war? Dark stuff? What kind of dark stuff? People die and cities are blown to the ground. How is it even possible for a game about a war, unless you don't kill anybody onscreen, to be a game for the whole family? Without any emphasis on the wars in the Lylat System, how can they keep Star Fox from turning into the 1980s G.I. Joe?

But yes, gameplay would be more important besides making the story more mature.

[Xortberg]

FINALLY somebody actually listens to me.

I always listen to those I debate.

Anyway, why would a grimdark storyline be a bad change for the series?

I shall answer this with an excerpt from my previous post.

If the current writing team makes the switch to dark and gritty, it'll still be the same shitty writing that you're complaining about and saying is 'too kiddy.' The only thing that would change is that they would write shittily to different subject matter.

The SF writing team is not skilled enough, if we go by their past performances, to pull off a good mature storyline. I never said making shit darker made it worse, for anything. I said that making it darker does not make it better.

You know what goes on in the series? War. What happens in war? Dark stuff? What kind of dark stuff? People die and cities are blown to the ground. How is it even possible for a game about a war, unless you don't kill anybody onscreen, to be a game for the whole family? Without any emphasis on the wars in the Lylat System, how can they keep Star Fox from turning into the 1980s G.I. Joe?

This is almost a legit point that I would need to think for a while to come up with a good answer to, if not for one fact: SF 64. It was an aerial dogfight simulator in space where you control anthropomorphic animals and use them to blow up your enemies. It successfully advertised and delivered to audiences of all ages. If you want an answer to your question, look at how they pulled it off in what is arguably the best game in the series, IMO.

[Samantha Weltzin]

You know what goes on in the series? War. What happens in war? Dark stuff? What kind of dark stuff? People die and cities are blown to the ground. How is it even possible for a game about a war, unless you don't kill anybody onscreen, to be a game for the whole family? Without any emphasis on the wars in the Lylat System, how can they keep Star Fox from turning into the 1980s G.I. Joe?

But yes, gameplay would be more important besides making the story more mature.

What you said here could indeed lead the way to StarFox taking a darker route, and it'd be the way to do it. That said, it also isn't entirely necessary either. Plenty of games have onscreen deaths that are basically brushed aside for the more lighthearted view, including, as Xort said, SF64. It can work either way. So yes, if Nintendo wanted to make StarFox darker, perhaps to distinguish it from several of its other, more lighthearted franchises and put it with its darker ones like Metroid, using the war backdrop à la Metal Gear Solid 4 would be a reasonable way to do it. Then again, the writers would probably still screw it up and make it lame anyway.

The fact that there's a debate going on right now about whether StarFox being a kids' game or leaning more toward teens and adults just means that it could go either way. The potential's there for both. I really doubt people have this sort of debate about Mario, for instance, because it has very clearly set itself on the "goofy-fun" side of the equation. StarFox, though? There are elements of both, so if it were to swing one way or the other, it wouldn't be a massive overhaul.

[ARWINGCOMMANDER 3987]

I fully agree with what Samantha just said above me.

[Milkyway64]

I fully agree with what Samantha just said above me.

No you don't, you've over and over argued that grimdark is the only way it can go, which Weltzin spoke against.

[ARWINGCOMMANDER 3987]

No you don't, you've over and over argued that grimdark is the only way it can go, which Weltzin spoke against.

My opinions change over time.

[Milkyway64]

And thus, after all this arguing, you finally agree with the things I've been saying?

notsureifsrs

[Samantha Weltzin]

I fully agree with what Samantha just said above me.

Whoa, really? I just ended a page-and-a-half debate?! o.O

Dude. Apparently I'm totally awesome! :D

[ARWINGCOMMANDER 3987]

And thus, after all this arguing, you finally agree with the things I've been saying?

notsureifsrs

I said I agreed with her, not you. :P

[Deploy]

Peppy is awesome.

The End. ^_^

[Samantha Weltzin]

I said I agreed with her, not you.

I basically said the same thing as Milky, but not as forcefully and with a little more wiggle-room. :P

[Robert Monroe]

Finally someone listened to you? Well then I guess Milky and Myself's counterpoints must've been imagined in a hallucinogenic stupor.

Either way, Xort and Sam have pretty much (re)said everything I was gonna say, so derp.

[JLCL00]

I think it would be interesting if a Star Fox game had mature elements in it (actually, previous games like Assault had some). Before I get replies saying I'm just a FPSfag who likes games about steroid-induced lone-wolf solders fighting against zombie/Nazi/aliens/Zombaziens, I just want to say the following. When I say mature, I don't mean adding head-exploding action with scantly-clad anthropomorphic animals while all characters cuss to the point it would make a sailor blush (although you could technically include all of that as mature but on a different reason). That would be considered more adult, from what I know. Anyhow, let me break down certain elements for me to talk about.

Blood: I'm open to see blood in SF. HOWEVER, not in the fashion of-say-Fallout 3/New Vegas or No More Heroes (*is a fan of, fyi*). I feel that blood should only be shown in concerns of story (aka cutscenes) and should only be shown on a smaller quantity based on how much is just right for a T-rated game.

Gore: Unless organs/body parts are shown in medical situations (e.g. an organ in a canister): no. That would just be going over the Teen rating. Although one could point me to the final boss fight in SF64 via Andross' brain as an example of gore, somehow.

Swearing/cursing: Like my stance on blood, it shouldn't be abused and should only occur rarely. It should only be used either for characters who are more likely to say it or in moments where it's appropriate. The only curse words I would be comfortable with are the ones considered not as bad such as "sucks, damn, and crap". Also, it should only be restricted to the story and not small sayings during gameplay.

Nudity: Like gore, this is going over the Teen rating if we include nipples and gentiles. I'm ok if it's just a silhouette but if it's like the stuff you'll see on sites like FA and Fchan, no way.

Overall, the only thing I would be concerned about is gameplay and story (or at least script-writing). That and maybe adding all the mentioning isn't necessary. If Exo Squad, an animated 90s sci-fi show, was able to immediately pull me in without blood, gore, swearing, or nudity, then I think a future Star Fox game would be able to do the same thing.

tl;dr d('_') to some mature elements, q('_') to EXTREME portions like gore and nudity. Overall, not important. Focus on gameplay and story.

[ICantLose74]

Peppy is awesome.

The End.

You my friend are AWESOME!!!!! +1,000,000 Wingmans to you. I've loved Peppy WAAAAAY before do a barrel roll became a fad, he's my favorite character out of all of StarFox and is in my top 5 video game characters. Actually if I remember right when I was kinda first playing StarFox64 I had to kinda make a splitsecond choice to choose who I wanted to save Falco or Peppy. There was no thought to this action, Peppy became my first priorty. Thanks for all your advice Peppy AND WHYD YOU HAVE TO RETIRE!!!!

But back to the topic. I'm not sure if StarFox is becoming more focused twoards mature audiences I mean maybe a little but the only reason I say that is because at the point where Krystal was added it made it added more of a relationship in the game, but when you get around that I guess it's still the same old StarFox. This is just my thoughts and I'm not even 100% sure on this opinion yet, it depends on what the future of StarFox holds.

[Braux]

I have a hard time trying to visualize a mature setting with, out of all things, anthros in it. I mean, normally in television and in videogames anthro characters have been in the realm of "kids stuff", if not that then the mature features of the game are done in a cartoony and comedic manner, example: Conkers bad fur day.

I dunno, whenever I play Starfox, I do it because I want to have fun, I want to blow up a space monkey's head using a small spacecraft that can take hits that would normally cripple a frigate. To me the series has always been an arcade shooter, and in the end your just really trying to get the high score, right? I mean, additional twists and suprises like peppy almost sacrificing himself were pretty cool, or James helping out Fox, but if I really wanted drama, gore, swearing, and the like, I'd probably play Call of Duty or Killzone.

[Shinigami]

Definitely needs more variety to it then just the main goals which almost always short-lived, though i wouldn't want it to get to the point where it'd be getting racial slur's and high level suggestive themes. I mean no one wants an imitation of the Fox Replacement For Gta San Andreas... >_>

This. I'm in complete agreement with. make it somewhat more mature, develop more complicated plots that won't be resolved by the end of the game, and as said, don't turn it into something similar to GTA - that would be overkill.

[Orthodox]

I have to agree with many of you. I like the classic, fun way that Star Fox started and still is today(except Command, I hate that game ). Yet I'd also like sort of a more serious one also. Multiple games for different audiences. How I would like it:

1. A more developed story. Yeah, it's a great universe, but the plot fails to capture my curiosity sometimes. Needs to be more well written. More drama maybe, and a bit darker tone.

2. More developed characters. Falco with his rough attitude is great, Slippy is overenthusiastic and annoying, but we need a bit of that. Fox could show a bit more emotion and toughness, and Krystal...more background. Everything else, just fine. I read some posts here, and I also think that she and Fox could have some nightmares and bad memories, and could find comfort with each other. Peppy is a-ok in my terms.

3. Better game play. I don't need excessive blood and gore in this game, I've seen too much of that. Maybe just a little blood, but nothing else. The ground stages could be first person or third person, depending on what the player chooses(they could alternate by pressing Select, or maybe it's an option). The flying stages could also alternate. Could use a bit more action, a bit more BOOM and maybe more PEW PEW.

That's all I have to say for now...

[Sluggsnipa]

My argument.

But in all seriousness,I thought I might come back into the equation.

StarFox has been a very-kid friendly game,like most Nintendo titles,their classics,and I know what all of you guys are thinking...ZOMG THER IZ LIKE LOTZA MATURE NIN10DOH TITLZ LIK: (Insert random Japanese Nintendo Title Never seen by American Eyes)...

But,when Nintendo or it's affiliates tried to make a more mature game,it usually recives an OK to Poor reception.I think that Nintendo needs to show a little love to our series.

StarFox could be a better series. I know many people who enjoyed StarFox,even my friend from east LA likes it,and I asked people on the flood if they liked it and many people said yes.

StarFox still needs a bit of maturity here and there,but I know that Nintendo isn't the company to do it. They tried making StarFox more mature with the addition of Adventures,and a

whole controversial era of the StarFox fandom,which was barely a mature game,all they had was one busty,blue,smexually appealing,skimpily outfitted,inevitably controversial,Krystal,

and one scene with a little blood. It should have been rated E+10. I watched Charlie's Angels when I was 7 and listened to Eminem when I was 5. Now I know you're thinking,not everyone

is raised in a house like yours,Sluggsnipa. That's true,and they could have been scared by any blood in Adventures,and their parents could've been offended by Krystal. I also know why

it's rated T for teens,because the E+10 rating came out sometime later. StarFox Assault had a slightly grittier atmosphere,but was a pretty kid friendly game.

Nintendo tried to Fix StarFox's bad reputation with Command,and they tried to make it a Space opera rail shooter. The plotline was so,unpredictable at points,and not in a good way.

They tried to add relationships to the mix,which enevitably turned our beloved series into BullShit. Every game since Adventures tried to be mature,but screwed with the canon.

Now we fans,arguing over things that might never come,are oblivious to what's happening to our StarFox series. They might get rid of the series after tthe 3DS release. After all,

StarFox was a "Test franchise". It showcased all of Nintendo's new toys,like the rumble pak,and others. I think Nintendo needs to show it a little more love,if they aren't going to,

they might as well sell the franchise to Microsoft or Sony...

In my opinion,we need a more mature StarFox game,done right.I don't want a StarFox Halo or Cod,suprisingly. The CHECKLIST:

1. Some Blood,not a lot,no onscreen blood unless you die.

2. First Person Shooter ,maybe a switch to Third Person option? There also should be Third Person Rail Shooter Segments.

3. Swearing,like Bad Company.

4. Grittier atmosphere,with a StarFox touch.

5. PLEASE FLESH OUT THE CHARACTER'S BACKSTORIES!

6. Some relationship drama,keep Krystal,but give some backstory to her for GOD'S SAKE! Right now she's just cardboard with double d's.

7. Give Fara,Miyu,and Fay another chance.

8. Partial Nudity,no yiff scenes,you could "scare away" potential fans. Make it classy,sillouheted...

9. BALLS-OFF-THE-WALLS EXPLIOSIONS AND ACTION PACKED GAMEPLAY!

10. Better storyline.

(Optional:Anime Cutscenes! Squee!)

[ZM Anonymous]

WE DON'T NEED A MATURE STARFOX

MAKE A GOOD ONE FIRST. THEN WE CAN TALK IF IT NEEDS TO BE MATURE

[Thu'um]

I dunno, whenever I play Starfox, I do it because I want to have fun, I want to blow up a space monkey's head using a small spacecraft that can take hits that would normally cripple a frigate. To me the series has always been an arcade shooter, and in the end your just really trying to get the high score, right? I mean, additional twists and suprises like peppy almost sacrificing himself were pretty cool, or James helping out Fox, but if I really wanted drama, gore, swearing, and the like, I'd probably play Call of Duty or Killzone.

I know right/ there are so many games today with blood and swear words , somtimes its nicer to play somthing a little more inocint. granted the story line cold be better in some places, but can't expect them to get it purfect, expasialy not after command

[JLCL00]

WE DON'T NEED A MATURE STARFOX

Yes we do. With gory ape-head explosions that splatter on the screen and naked vixens rolling in petroleum oil

So far from what I read, most agree that it doesn't have to be mature to the point of leveling GTA/Call of Duty/Fallout 3/every other game that has an absurd amount of blood, gore, and/or swearing. Most likely, no one will notice the difference. In my previous post, I just stated the same thing except that blood wouldn't be part of the gameplay and, instead, only appear via cutscene. Swearing will rarely be said and be restricted to words pre-teens would usually say. I can't explain everything what I said earlier so for those interested, read from there.

Besides, I'm just imputing my thoughts into the discussion. It's not like I'll raeg and rip a new one when the next game ends up not including any of the mentioned. Like others said: if the gameplay is great, I don't have a problem.

[WXfox4God]

Something this culture, as a whole, has lost is that you can have a great story without all the gore, excessive cursing and nudity. Script writers used to be clever and were able to capture large audiences without that stuff. I believe that is still possible, too. I understand why CoD has gore and its language...I understand what GTA has its...well everything That stuff is (for the most part...) based off of reality.

Foxes flying around in space shooting giant monkeys is not real. Its an escape from reality. A fun fantasy world where you don't have to worry about the complexities of life. If you want to put in a couple curse words...fine, whatever. I think there is a pretty good consensus on what would be tolerable and what would cross the line. A little blood in the cut scenes...sure! Krystal was a good addition to the franchise and I think her relationship with fox should be developed more. The two should get married and have kids (think the Marcus McCloud route of Command.) BUT, it is possible to develop a relationship, a marriage, and a family without including nudity or the likes. Keep it an escape from reality.

I really, really hope they continue this franchise (I admit I have my doubts...) but that they keep things user friendly for everyone. I want nothing more than for my kids in 5-10 years to be able to get as excited about new versions of Starfox as I was when I encountered Starfox64.

[LoneWolf]

I agree that there is a fine line between not enough and too much. I think that the series could use a little bit of cursing, maybe a small dash of blood on a character's face as he stumbles out of the cockpit of a crashed ship for dramatic effect, but an extreme GTA kind of deal is going a bit far.

And no, NO kids. Not this early in the series.